Trainer Michael McCarthy joins PTF and JK to talk about City of Light and the Pegasus World Cup win. Plus, the guys give their thoughts on the big race and a quick recap of the turf.
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Your listening to the, in the money players podcast. Hello and welcome to the, in the money players podcast. This is show number 11. It is Tuesday, January 29th. I am once again, in the Brooklyn bunker back from a whirlwind business trip to London doing about six hours of TV a night, Friday, Saturday, Sunday.
Gave out a couple of winners, not as many as I would’ve liked, but had a very good time hanging out with the crew over there and got to really enjoy the Pegasus night. And best of all, I didn’t have to deal with that crazy deluge. The man I’m about to introduce was in the midst of that deluge. I don’t know what happened to him in the contest yet.
We have not spoken. Can’t wait to hear all the [00:01:00] stories from the people’s champion, Jonathan kitchen. What’s up. My man. Well, I got to go ahead and let everybody know that, uh, someone who’s going to be joining us a little bit later is. Solely responsible for the reason that my voice sounds like, uh, the, the root for a city of life took a toll on my vocal cord.
So star that you have to listen to me, sound like, I think I got an elephant sitting. Yeah. Oh my goodness. You are, you are horse. There’s no doubt about it. I’ve never had it happen. I’ve never gotten a three-day laryngitis from a horse racing route before. Do you remember, did you go with a classic? Was this a go on my son’s situation where you rooting Havi?
How did you, uh, approach this route? We were, um, it was, I was right next to the Prince of Keeneland and we were, uh, we were in a suite and they have to have a big glass windows. And I was, we were banging on the glass window cause we have a turnaround because of the, you know, the weather and stuff. We turned around to watch the [00:02:00] very end on the screen when they were at the top of the stretch.
And, uh, it was just simply, uh, come on city, come on city, come on, city and city. He was unbelievable. What a performance. We talked about it for a long time, the different tactics that went into it. I think I’ll claim victory for the way that it played out in terms of the flopping outside and stalking, and then going on with it, as opposed to the dead send you were recommending.
But it doesn’t matter. I think this horse could have employed all manner of tactics and gotten the job done. How impressed were you put, take your fan hat off, put your analyst hat on and tell me how impressed you are with city of light and. JK tip the hand on this few minutes from now, Michael McCarthy going to be joining us for his first appearance on the, in the money players podcast.
But JK, what are your thoughts on this race? I thought it was extremely impressive and you’re right. You did win that head to head. If you, if you want, you can put that in your head to head category on the trip. That was a victory by you. Um, I thought he was brilliant. Um, you know, I [00:03:00] think he’s, he’s, uh, he’s a really special horse where, you know, you don’t see it too often where he won two grade, one’s going seven for a long time.
And then also want a grade one in the, in the world’s richest race for, uh, well, it was, you know, what I meant by that changed a little bit now with the turf, but, uh, and, and won a grade, one going a mile and an eighth in that race. So, uh, really says a lot about the quality of, of city of light and, and also our, our, our, our guests, Mike McCarthy, in terms of his ability to, to, uh, show up on all these big stages with these big horses and, and, and only have a, whatever it is, 20, 30, 40 of them in training.
It is pretty amazing. Can’t wait to talk to Mike in a little bit, so many questions to deal with in the aftermath of this race. Does it take anything away from you from Excel it’s body of work? The fact that he was not able to extend his streak and get the job done today. And do you feel like it should have any bearing when you look back, will you feel better about your horse of the year vote?
Do you think I should [00:04:00] feel worse about mine or like me. Do you feel like he really didn’t lose much here and it’s not particularly relevant? I don’t think it’s particularly relevant. I wouldn’t want to, um, I wouldn’t want to. Hold this race against them, not so much for the, for the, for the, uh, because of the surface.
I just, all I’ve always thought that accelerate is probably better going longer than a mile and a quarter. I feel like as mile and an eighth race as he was, he was kind of helped by the racetrack and, and, uh, and facing all horse, like city of light, who I thought was kind of sitting on a monster race. I, you know, I, I don’t take anything away from accelerating what he did throughout his, uh, 2018, you know, year and his career as a whole.
Uh, both of those horses obviously should be very proud. And, um, uh, when it comes to breeding, I, I don’t, I don’t know a ton about it, but, uh, Ran into, uh, to a lot of people this weekend. And a lot of people are excited about the horses opportunity, uh, when he goes to start, I believe he’s already full for next year.
Accelerate is [00:05:00] going to be an interesting one to watch. As far as that goes, I want to pause for a minute. We talked about the tactics in terms of our discussion before the race, but I really thought this was an amazing job by Javier. Getting him out, getting him to relax at just the right time saying, go at the right time.
Your thoughts on a little more on Javier performance, specifically, given all the questions that came up with the weather and the way that the track was playing. I thought it was great. I mean, I thought that, you know, I didn’t think it’s just not how Chad horses are written. I understand that pattern recognition was a, is a horse that’s forward and he was stretching out, but I didn’t see.
Uh, I didn’t see Jose feeling that I was going to be his best chance to clear city of light. I thought he would try to sit off of them, hope that city of light and didn’t like the, the, the slop or, or, uh, maybe, you know, city of light was over the top. Um, and so when he did that, it really gave Javier the opportunity to be able to cause he was still forward as well.
Cause steady of light broke really well to be able to just. [00:06:00] Kind of flop right outside of city of light and to get him in the clear, and then when he was ready to go, uh, the horse kind of did the majority of the work at the quarter pole it’s, you know, he was in hand still. So it was amazing though. It shaped up on paper for a second.
Like many would have thought with accelerate coming to his neck at one point. But I feel like for experience race Watchers, we’ve seen accelerated that point. Extended jockey’s hands moving up and down the neck. Meanwhile, Javier with the double handful, still the real race as it were over before it started.
Yeah. Without a doubt, it was never really in doubt. And in all honesty, that race. I don’t know what it says, and I don’t know if it’s a problem, but the three runnings of that race have all gone to the favorite and pretty impressive fashion, uh, to California. You know, obviously California Chrome didn’t show up that day, but with irrigate, a gun runner and now city of light, you know, he took a lot of money.
I know that he was actually technically, he was a second [00:07:00] shooter. I was going to say, you’re kidding me. He went, favored over accelerated. What are you talking about? Uh, no, but he, he, they clicked for him late. They came for him late. So it was, you know, it was much closer than the morning line at indicated.
Yeah, I was following only the UK batting. And my biggest case for city of light all night was you were getting the two to one, as opposed to the three to two. I figured they would both on the USA tote go lower than that. I didn’t actually see what happened in the end. I did see in the end, a one 12 buyer speed figure for city of light.
It was terrific. Very, very exciting. I think this is going to maybe end up being a form full race more years than not. I don’t think that’s necessarily a bad thing to you. No, not at all. And I think that, that, uh, as it kind of continues to settle in, as a tradition, it’ll continue to grow and more people will, uh, will, will, will start to show up for it.
And it’s, you know, and I also think that. You know, and at some point we’re going to get that good older [00:08:00] horse and that good younger horse. And we’re going to get that champion filly that are gonna all jump in there and it’s going to be a real race. And you know, not that it wasn’t a real one, but it’ll be a real exciting dynamic, lots of different things can happen situation.
And in all honesty, I think a lot of people who may or may not have bet on seeking the soul. Thought that he ran. I ran a race that, that, uh, that without getting stopped at Johnny got stopped cold, like right outside the three eights. If he didn’t get stopped, it would have been a, it could have potentially been a closer margin of victory.
Do you think he could have won it didn’t occur to me that he could have won the race, honestly, until you were saying that trouble or no trouble. Is this a closer margin situation or do you think it really might’ve cost the w no, I don’t think he was going to win. I just think it would have been, you know, he would have been a little bit closer.
Um, uh, he, he definitely ran a winning race. Uh, it just so happened to be, uh, that city of light was in there as well. And then he ran, he ran his way, gunna Vera for me, probably to close early might’ve cost him making that, run that, seeking the soulmate instead. Certainly a nice Exacta [00:09:00] and very relevant when it comes to talking about the, the, the contest, the Pegasus contest.
Did you have another thought to piggyback on there? Yeah, just a fun, fun story about seeking the soul. Uh, was in the, in the suite with angel Cortaro, obviously Johnny Velazquez is a, uh, agent and angel was, was upset that he missed the tri they, they put it, he put it, he played a try with the Piper and they missed the tri and we’re all looking at him like, ain’t, you just ran second and like, I think he made like 20 grand right there.
You’ll be fine. That’s great. Let’s talk about the Pegasus contest. Word of warning. The way our timing is working today between JKS travel schedule. He’s still in South Florida trying to get Mike McCarthy on which we’re going to do in a few minutes. We’re probably not going to finish our discussion of Pegasus day.
Just a warning. We will pick it up on Friday. We don’t have time to do a full show today necessarily. So I’m just going to hit on a few random things and don’t think I’m giving terribly short trip to hidden scroll or the turf if we [00:10:00] only touch on them briefly. But right now I want to talk about the contest.
In the end, it was won by Preston Sims. Big big try. It sounded like in the last race, once again, somebody who was pretty close to down to the nub, hitting the last race and getting the job done in the Pegasus. Another conversation we’re going to put a pin in, but it just, I throw it out here to you J as a future topic for discussion, it seems like this race, excuse me, this contest in particular does have the potential to.
Almost always going to be one that falls down to this last race, something to discuss in the future, if that’s a potential issue or something that needs to be addressed, or if it’s just the way it is. But I want to hear your story of the Pegasus contest and you can touch on that here, if you want to do so quickly or we’ll save it for another.
I turned quite a bit on Friday. I was, I was, I played a lot of doubles. I didn’t really love anything. I didn’t swing too hard. I just. Kind of methodically played. I think you had to make [00:11:00] five, $800 bets. I think I made $6,000 bets. Uh, pretty much the same on both entries. Uh, woke up in the morning with about 10, five on each and made an attempt to, to go all in with, with all 20 on doubles, uh, from the second to the third race, into a world of trouble.
Um, and I, uh, I used seven horses, uh, waited and waited doubles. And, um, I, you know, that the same, we’ve talked about all the time you live by the info, you die by the info. And, uh, info has been good lately. I called our buddy that has a tie with loot racing and asked if they had any, uh, any thoughts about the two horses they had in there had a horse that they just claimed and a horse that had been in the, in the, in their ownership for awhile.
And the information was they liked the outside horse much better. Um, so I did not use the, the other horse who was seven to two morning line and drifted up to nine to one, uh, the, the, the one they liked dropped the rider at the [00:12:00] start. The one that didn’t like, uh, won the race at nine Oh one. Which horse was that?
Uh, it was like a, it was an early, it was like, uh, I dunno, they were like claimers. It was early in the day. I don’t even know the name of the horse. I couldn’t tell you. Gotcha. But you don’t feel bad live by the info, die by the info. You’ve said it many times. And how do you think it would have turned out, projecting on into the future?
Do you think your fortunes might’ve gone down with copper town or do you think you could have stayed in till the end and made a showing here? If you’re looking at it objectively. Yeah, I probably would have been in trouble with copper town. However, the leaderboard didn’t start to get away. So if I would have been in contention, I might’ve found it a little bit of a over bedding, the pot to use a poker reference.
If I were to bet what I had planned on betting, I was going to go all in on copper town. Um, speaking of copper town, it’s it’s, you know, hung out with the racetrack. Last two mornings. Uh, the Prince of Caitlin was with, you know, we were at Palm beach downs and watching Todd’s army there. And then also watching one of his horses with, with George Weaver.
And a lot of the talk [00:13:00] around was that copper town banged his head. Pretty good when he, uh, at right before the start and the, kind of the question of why they didn’t at least back them out of the gate and look at him. Um, and so, uh, I think that a lot of people who thought copper town was going to run well, kind of giving him an excuse for that race where, you know, like you said, he banged his head pretty good.
You know, Mike Maloney talks about it in the book you guys worked on together. Now that can be one of those hidden trips that can really. Uh, it really caused some problems. You know, you go out and you’re a front yard, bang your head up against the wall and then go run a mile bedding with an edge. The book J K is referring to.
And that is a good story in there. And I’ll tell you what, when copper town comes back, he’s going to have two really ugly races in that PP. Having an excuse for that second one. I had said on air Hm. Might be done with hearing the stories about copper town, but that excuse might be enough to give him one more chance.
I’m sure. We’ll talk about that race. Whenever it is. Speaking of excuses, JK, do you have one for Yoshi? [00:14:00] No, I, you know, you can’t really say it was the ground. Cause that was something that he’s always, uh, he’s, he’s performed well on it. Derby day and the turtle classic. And then also at Pimlico, um, I guess maybe he was a little bit far back.
Um, he made that run in any range. I thought for a second, he was gonna, he was gonna probably be, be dangerous, but, uh, no, nothing really, nothing really to, to look for. I think maybe we’ll see him get back to the dirt. Um, I think that that was probably. Yeah, I think he, he could have been, uh, maybe second or third and the dirt race that he would’ve ran in that one, the way that it kind of set up.
Interesting point about the dirt race, for sure. I’ll be curious to hear more stories. I was really hoping we were going to get to see a queen and run from him, but maybe it’s tricky to go after that, or maybe there’s an excuse and the turf career will continue on a abated this season. Questions to answer for another day, bricks and mortar.
I made the case on the show. I can’t claim as [00:15:00] a winner, but we did talk about how I thought the horse could run well and bricks and mortar certainly did Chad Brown showing once again that it’s his world and we just live in it. What did you think of that one? You know, I really had a hard time with this race.
I, I was kind of against bricks and mortar. Uh, it’s a little bit hard to swallow even now that, that a horse who, whose previous race was in an allowance race, uh, is now showing up and running in a $7 million race in one bite. It was a prep. I mean, and look at the figure. I mean, I don’t, that just doesn’t even sound like I’m talking to you that you’d question so much a Chad Brown horse, because it ran in allowance race.
I mean, he was clearly getting it set up. I don’t get it. Yeah, well, it, it, I guess it was more the, the fashion in which he did it. It’s, it’s not like he blitz that field and he was nine to five. And, and, and it’s just a weird thing that you, you, you see that there, you know, he runs it. Yeah. Like that. And then you think he’s going to show up and running the richest turf race in North America and win by two.
Um, that, that part of it was just a little bit harder for [00:16:00] me to, to, to, to wrap my brain around, but he’s pretty stinking good. And it turns out that, uh, I accused them of being the B team and he’s. Obviously, definitely on, on, on the 18 now. And he probably wasn’t even before the race. So, um, he ran, well, I tell you that probably the most.
Disappointing, obviously as the Japanese Philly who looked like she threw it in reverse. Yeah, I got off her completely based on the ground. It was just, there was some question about the added distance, the best form wasn’t with that level of cut in the ground. And I felt like her chance kind of went out the window with the way the ground changed and even drifting on the tote pools up to nine to one, I went in a different direction, but the direction I went.
Was all Yoshida. I mean, when I was talking about how I like bricks and mortar, it was at the UK prices of six to one earlier in the week with him as short as five to two. And Yoshida as square as he was and Mott winning races on the undercard. I just went all Yoshida in that race. So I [00:17:00] didn’t, uh, didn’t get any joy from my point of view, but I certainly understood the case for bricks and mortar.
And I don’t think you’re wrong. When you say he was the B team, there was some quote from Chad about some of the other horses he might’ve considered for the spot. They had already sort of had the plans mapped out and bricks and mortar was the one who could be successfully rerouted. They announced the race so late.
So you might not have been wrong about that. And it might just be at the end of the day, JK another Testament to how powerful a force on racing and especially turf racing. Chad Brown is in the USA. Is that fair? Absolutely. I mean, like I said, I just thought he was going to be over bet. I thought, Oh, there’s there were so many reasons to kind of go against him.
And, uh, at least I had convinced myself of that I was wrong. I used them in the pick five, but I used them very sparingly as is almost like a saver. And, uh, and so, uh, the amount of money we put in to play the pick five, [00:18:00] um, we, you know, I, I barely got most of it back, so, okay. It’s time for our special guests to appear.
We’ve got him live from the backstretch, Michael McCarthy. How are you? My friend. Really good. Thank you guys for having me. Absolutely. It’s a pleasure. You’ve had a couple of days to contemplate this huge win from Saturday. You’re charged city of light, getting it done in the Pegasus world cup invitational.
How are you feeling reflecting back with a couple of days? Hindsight, it’s been a pretty hectic 72 hours, you know, a lot of travel and obviously emotions running high on Saturday night. Coming right back down to earth on Sunday morning, send them off to lane, said the travel and everything that goes in gets involved, but come back to work on Monday morning, you hit the ground running and.
See, you know, you might not find yourself in another city of light, but next first time starters, just right around the corner. So he’ll be missed, but we’ll look forward to the [00:19:00] challenge of finding another one. There’s that great picture taken by? I think it was Zoe Mets. Must’ve been Sunday morning, uh, purporting to be the moment when you were saying goodbye to city of light, what do you think of that picture?
And what’s going on in your head during it? Yeah. You know, for me, it’s a little bit different. Well, we do a lot of it is about kind of letting go, you know, horses come in, they’re there for. Three weeks, whether they’re claimed and run back and claimed by somebody else or they get to you, they need to go to the farm to be stopped on for a while.
In a case like this, is this a special deal where the horse has been part of the family for two years? Um, He’s obviously done a lot for not only my family, but everybody that works for me. So kind of seeing him a way of seeing him off is a little bit bittersweet in the case of my daughter and city of light.
He’s a big, powerful horse, but he’s very docile as Jonathan can attest to Saturday mornings. And sometimes after school she’d like to come and just kind of hang out, [00:20:00] buy a stall, pet him, feed him carrots. So. Like any little, any little kid would, do they get attached to, you know, their idols or things like that.
In this case, it just happened to be a horse for her. And I don’t think she understand the way we were talking and speaking about the horse, going to stuff. She didn’t realize that that kind of encompass the horse leaving, going to Kentucky and not coming back to San Anita with us. So she was a little, obviously a little heartbroken and.
Zoe was the right place, the right time to capture that. You mentioned that, uh, that, that, uh, I was able to kind of be able to spend a little time around city of light this week, and then also a breeders’ cup. And, and, uh, so I just want to know that one night when we went back and I held the phone light, what percentage of city of lights victory has to do with the help that I was able to provide that evening?
I think you gave him a golden Apple. I think that gold is apples. We’ll put them over the top. A horse like that, you try to spend as much time around them as you [00:21:00] can. Obviously we go back to every night and check them. And that was one of the things that gave me, uh, a bunch of confidence going into Saturdays and we’d go back every evening to water off and check his feet, tub, and you know, nine o’clock at night, 10 o’clock at night, his feed would be totally done.
And that’s always a good sign. It’s a sign of a healthy horse and a happy horse. So. Um, I’m just glad you were able there to help out. W was he bothering you Mike all week? Was he just constantly at the bar? And how do you, how do you deal with these interlopers? He was a, he was a pleasant distraction, I guess you could say.
Yeah. So I really couldn’t have done it without him. Um, no, but you know, you guys were always on the road doing contests and stuff like that. So it’s nice to see you guys from time to time. Nice to have some friends around and be able to take your mind off a Saturday afternoon. Obviously. There’s. So much that goes in, gets that goes into getting the horse ready for a race like that, to be able to kind of share it with friends is [00:22:00] pretty special.
The only failure I can say that Michael had on Saturday was he was, he wasn’t able to get a picture with Snoop dog. Oh, you tried and failed to get getting that sweepstakes. I gave it the old college try. I don’t think Snoop is a fan of the rain. He’s definitely no Prince. He would make, he wouldn’t make some very good halftime entertainment, super bowl.
That’s for sure. Prince was actually a racing fan from what I’ve heard, I’ve heard that he in some. Previous life either had wanted to be, or at least was just hugely respectful of jockeys. And I’ve heard stories about him hanging out at the track. Did you ever see any evidence of this or did you just mention him because of the rain at the super bowl?
I bet you didn’t cause the rain at the super bowl. I did not know he was a racing fan. Alls I know, really know about princess is. What I learned from Dave Chappelle, to be honest with you, we always ask folks on the show when they’re guests for the first time to talk a little bit about how they got [00:23:00] involved in racing in your case, is this something you were born into or how did you come to it?
Right. A couple of friends, I went to high school with Michael Sherlock and Marty Jones. Both of their fathers are trainers here at San Anita, Southern California. I’d see friends. Family worked on the front side and another friend Corey black went on to become a jockey. Um, so I was sort of a product of my environment would spend some time after school at the races going to watch the last couple of races palling around on the weekend and stuff like that.
As we got out of high school, I really enjoyed the, the environment, the animals and the early morning. So I took a liking to it. I really started to, you know, Enjoy more and more time around the horses themselves. Fortunate enough. It took me to a lot of places before I got to where I am today. You know, Hong Kong, Dubai, Japan, Ireland, England.[00:24:00] So, no, I, this is, this is I’m the only person in my family. It’s got anything to do with racing. My father is a sporting man and likes to gamble from time to time. My brother’s a surfer. So, yeah, there’s no racing connection. I’m the only one. Yeah. You talk about making a wager on a sporting event, obviously betting so important to driving the game of horse racing.
What is your attitude as a horseman when it comes to betters in general and how important is handicapping and studying the racing form to what you do? You know, well, for me, it’s a, it’s a little bit different. If there’s no gamblers, there’s really no racing game. Obviously pools drive our sport, whether it be a race, you know, whether it be through the windows, whether it be, you know, over the internet and just fans in general.
From a handicapping standpoint, I would say, I look at things a little bit differently than you guys might do, per se. You guys are [00:25:00] obviously looking at combinations and tickets and things like that. I’m worried about three things. Really. I’m worried about pace. I’m worried about race setup and I’m worried about the competition really.
So what, what I buy handicapping is very basic. I want to know who’s going to be on the lead. Who’s going to be coming from off the pace. I’m going to kind of look at some rider type things. So from a day to day on a day-to-day basis, gambling doesn’t creep into my mind. I think if it did, it might sort of affect some of the decisions that I make in the afternoon.
Plus I hate, I hate losing money. So, um, I think that’s one of the things of the discipline gambler. They ha they, they realize that, you know, the calculated risk that goes into that’s involved and like you guys do, you know, playing in contests and stuff like that, you can’t win every time, but you know, every bet counts.
Um, I have a lot of friends that [00:26:00] are very good gamblers. This is, you know, it’s, it’s their lifeblood. And they’re fans of racing as well. So I would actually like to know a little bit more about how you guys do it and what you guys do, because just by asking John some questions about tickets, structure, and algorithms and all those kinds of things that he comes up with, it’s really fascinating, you know, but I’m going to stick to what I know for right now.
And so a handicapping question in, in, in regards to city of light, Uh, we mentioned a little bit earlier, how, you know, he was talented enough to win two grade. One’s going one turn the seven furlongs and then also the mile at an eight. W what do you think was actually like his best distance and what situation do you think would have been?
You know, if you had to run, if you got to run city of light back, one more time at a $10 million race, where would you want to run in? And what distance would you want? You think would be best for him? After what I saw on Saturday night, I have to say at a mile and an eight, I thought it was two [00:27:00] sprint races going seven, eight were very good.
I refuse to believe he couldn’t get a mile and a quarter, obviously in the sanity of the gold cup, it kind of found him out last three 16th of a mile. I don’t know if I can offer any real excuse. He may not have liked the track that day. It seemed a little bit deep. That’s best course, one on the day, but for as good as he was going a mile at the Breeder’s cup, I thought maybe with the addition of a little bit of an off race track on Saturday night, that mile and eight performance blew me away.
It was truly awesome. How much did you and Javier discuss tactics before the race? It seemed like there were a lot of different possibilities. Well, really dead send or try to stalk as it turned out being the two main ones. But I was curious how much input you had in the way that, that played out on Tuesday at [00:28:00] the post position draw, there were two spots left.
The 12 post position and the three post position. If we draw the 12, it changes things completely. We were lucky enough. We drew the three. We had to employ the same type of tactics that we employed at the breeders’ cup. Let him go ahead and run a runaway from there. When pattern with pattern recognition through in the 12, who was obviously the other controlling speed drew way outside, we knew he’d have to be used up a little bit to get to us accelerate.
Two stalls over in the five. So my feeling was first and foremost, when he ran into forego, he broke just, okay. That day to ground kind of came out from underneath him. He broke so hard. I like getting with his short run into the first turn at Gulfstream park. It was impairing of us for us to leave there, running the race, kept on getting a little bit delayed, delayed, delayed.
Javier was able to go ahead and walk the horse up nicely. So we. In the paddock I told Javier, just go ahead, do whatever you need to do to go ahead and [00:29:00] establish your position early. I was very surprised at pattern recognition, got to us as fast as he did. Javier said he was able to look over it at pattern recognition and can see he was dead set on getting the lead.
We were. No able to go ahead and just kind of ease back off of pattern recognition, going into the first turn. It would hop your God outside of him. I thought that was the race right there. Turning up the backside went up. Javier moved him out a path from about the three paths into the four path. His gears went up and really from there, whether he water ran last, he had zero excuses.
She had the perfect trip up until that point turned up the backside. It was a beautiful thing as a city of light fan and city of light backer to see that double handful as they turned from home. And even though accelerate was running, we were just going so much the better your emotions at that point must have started to well up.
Yeah. As far as, even like you just mentioned earlier about what kind of instructions there was so much going on [00:30:00] in the paddock and, you know, the it’s kind of that amphitheater aspect, um, all these people around you and you know, the noise and commotion. And I don’t have a whole lot to say usually in the paddock.
I just said that, Javier, Hey, look, we know what we got to do. Go ahead and get through running away from there. You ride them like you own them. Every time you give someone like Javier a leg up, obviously the hall of fame in bill, you’re getting a professional. Um, so I basically left it up to him. He’s been in these situations a lot more times than I have go with what, you know, It was awesome.
Let me ask you this. One of my colleagues on TV speculated based on the quality of the performance that city of light had, he decided to contest the classic instead of the dirt mile might have won that race. It’s interesting. You revisit the idea of impossibly getting the 10 furlongs. I can’t help shake the idea that had he [00:31:00] contested the classic Guevara, maybe passes them all.
Cause they’ve got to go that much faster and are going to be attacked earlier by another quality horse. What’s your thought? Looking back, are you D if I won’t make you, uh, make a prediction, but are you obviously, and you’re obviously pleased with the way that everything worked out, but do you have any second thoughts about that at all?
You know, Javier had mentioned the same type of thing to me after we were walking back through the tunnel afterwards that he felt that there was no reason why a horse like him and the way he ran on Saturday, couldn’t get a mile and a quarter. Obviously the perfect setup like we had Saturday would probably make that a lot easier.
I think for him, It all depends on the w what I can tell so far or, or what I, my opinion is just that it seems like the tighter, the racetrack, the better it was for him, uh, Oaklawn park was a wet, fast race. So I [00:32:00] certainly seem like it helped him out the deluge on Saturday, but I just think a good racetrack was the secret to that horses, you know, is one of the secrets.
I mean, obviously he’s incredibly talented, but I think in the right setup, in the right scenario, Yes, I think he would be able to get them all in a quarter. You have so many friends in racing. What has been the reaction from the community? Former colleagues bosses at Satra since Saturday, overwhelming, incredibly nice 620 something.
Text messages, mailbox full on your phone, emails, all kinds of stuff. You know, the racetrack is a funny place. All here, we all compete against each other jockey, sit in the same room together all day long and compete against each other. But there is a family type of an atmosphere around here. Um, and a lot of my colleagues were very complimentary, means a lot to me, even your man, Jonathan Thomas, I figured he’d find some way to stick the [00:33:00] needle in.
Now you talked about Jonathan Kenton being a vital role. I don’t know if I could have done it without Jonathan Thomas. He was nice enough to go ahead and let us stable at his barn for the week. And he came down three or four times during the week to supervise, to make sure we were doing everything right.
So. I have to give him an assist as well. There does seem to be a great bond. And you mentioned familial bond. I see that with you guys, when you’re talking and throwing lines back and forth, it does almost seem like brothers, as opposed to colleagues. We were fortunate enough to become friends before we were colleagues.
When I first went to work for Todd Fletcher, Jonathan wasn’t working Christophe cobalt. Jonathan went to work for Dale Romans, obviously. Big part of roses and may, um, then he went off to Saudi Arabia, spent some time in Saudi Arabia, came back and spent five years working for Todd, which was, um, obviously at that time, a wonderful [00:34:00] addition to the team we’ve remained close.
You know, he’s a bright guy, intelligent guy, educated guy, a worldly guy, very good friend, really, really lucky to have a bunch of the friends that I have. You know, John Pentagon, who’s obviously Javier as agents. It makes things nice. When you can share these types of things with guys who have received the you’re also your friends, you know, that’s really cool and makes a lot of sense.
One more question for you, just looking back on your career to this point, you had the opportunity to work. For Todd Pletcher for so long. When you think back to the lessons you learned in that operation, is there one that stands out above the others or one that might have helped in particular when it came to managing the career of city of light?
Boy, there’s so many things, you know, Tazi. For me, he leads by example. So when you’re lucky enough to be around all these good horses, see what some of them can take. What some of them can’t take, [00:35:00] how much to push the needle with some of them, each horse has an individual. I think that’s where his strong suit is.
I think the most important thing is he just told me to, you know, taught me to sort of trust your horse. You know what he said, what are you seeing from him? What is he showing you? And in this case, this horse was showing me everything I wanted to see. His attitude was great. He was moving great. Had a wonderful work over the track.
His appetite was, was as good as I’d ever seen it. I mean, he was eating almost 17 courts of grain a day. Um, It was the perfect storm. So being around so many, as I said, so many good horses, the uncle Mose, going to the Breeder’s cup, juvenile, the rags to riches, the Kentucky Oaks, palace mouth for the Belmont.
You just get a feel for what it takes to get to a big day like that and what to expect on a big day. Although for. $9 million. It was a little bit nerve wracking, especially getting to the race track, and then obviously going in and saddling and stuff like [00:36:00] that. It all kind of came to a head as we were down in the walking ring, uh, it really hit home.
The magnitude of something like this. Um, you know, he had provided me with the tools to succeed, let it run my operation or my string while I was working for him as it was as if it was my own. So. A lot of top Fletcher influencing to what, what went on on Saturday evening. It was magical to watch Michael McCarthy.
Thank you so much for your time today and for appearing on the podcast. We hope to have you back and get to hang out with you soon. Thank you guys. Let that dog back out, Michael. Thanks again. Cheers. JK. Pretty cool. Oh, absolutely. No, it was a, it was a ton of fun. You know, I, I got to meet Michael with, uh, Jake palace, I guess maybe it was two years ago.
Jake had a horse that he wanted to try to get down the Hill. And his relationship with Michael started when, when, you know, one of Jake’s first horses was a horse by the name of joining the dance that was with [00:37:00] Todd. And he also had a few other horses with Todd, a horse by the name of race day that he helped buy and short.
Um, anyways, so he got to know Mike, and when we got to go out to Del Mar to hang out, in fact, We were there when I met Mike the morning that said he city of light, uh, one with Gary Stevens at Del Mar. Um, and so, uh, we’ve stayed in contact and, and, uh, one of the things that, that, that I liked the most about Mike and really about anybody is, is I like people who are comfortable enough in them with their own knowledge of something to ask someone their opinion, they don’t feel like they have all the answers and.
And, uh, you know, Duke will tell you that he was, he was blown away. One time we were sitting in a suite of CNN, Anita and Mike asked a question just about the pace and, and about what he thought, uh, the pace would be in the distance would be in a race and how that would set up for city of light based on all the handicapping information that we all have as horse players and, and.
And that’s the kind of guy that you could really root for. And when they [00:38:00] have that success at the top level, it’s really exciting how I felt emotional, a lot of what happened this weekend, just cause I knew how much it meant to him and how hard he’s worked and taking that chance of going on his own and all of those things.
So it’s been great. Very cool. When you really have been there since the beginning in a funny way, I had forgotten that little part of the story, actually. All right. We said, it’s going to be a short show and we’re going to live up to that. We both have tons of stuff we have to get done, but I know JK, you alluded on Twitter, you have an announcement to make what’s up.
Yeah. Um, I don’t know, you know, funny as I met a hundred percent sure what the name of this show is, I think it’s like Saturday at the races or something, but Niara recently announced that they were going to be doing. Um, that partnership with Fox with over $400 of, of broadcasting, which is going to include, I believe every race from Saratoga, it will be on a Fox network.
I believe it’s Fox sports to our Fs two. Um, and I think maybe some of the bigger races will sneak over to some of the bigger channels, but, [00:39:00] uh, I was, uh, I was, uh, asked to be a part of, and so this Saturday is going to be the first one. I think we’re going to head out to Santa Anita. I don’t know who I’m going to be on with.
Um, but I’m looking forward. Tony olive auto has been great and kind of getting me on board and I’m looking forward to doing that for the rest of this year. Uh, wherever, wherever they go. I won’t be at every show. Uh, but I’ll be at, uh, at, at quite a bit. And then, and then Saratoga, obviously this summer and, and, uh, looking forward to, it sounds like I need to get the garage ready.
It gives the garage, the, the, the only place you don’t need to get ready is that haunted basement. Yeah. When you come to Belmont, you’re going to, I don’t know. Maybe you can find somebody to let you stay in a tack room somewhere. If you’re too a scaredy cat to come stay in the bunker here with they’ll go with me and the ghosts.
Well, I can trust you. I’m too scared. Sleeping upstairs in the red couch works. You’re more than welcome anytime. It’s a very exciting new development in your career in all seriousness, excited to see you as part of those [00:40:00] Fox broadcasts. Unlike me, you don’t have to travel halfway around the world to do a television interview.
No problem is I gotta get a haircut now and I gotta do something about this. This facial hair. And, uh, uh, when I went on last time, when I went on to kinda, when they had me come up, just to kind of, I guess when they were trying to figure out who they were going to use, I told Tony, I was like, Tony, I’m not really like a suited and booted guy.
Like, is that okay? Do I do I in, you know, and, uh, I got away with it then, so I’ll probably have to step my game up a little bit, uh, moving forward. But, uh, I, I, I don’t think you’re going to see too many ties. You can be very comfortable in a suit. Some of them are essentially just like pajamas for adults.
I’d suggest going in that direction. You mean, I can’t wear a t-shirt. I don’t know. You can like make it your gimmick the way most people don’t wear hats on TV, but I do, I’ve tried to make it my gimmick, you know, and now when I don’t do it, the host will make fun of me. Maybe you can be the guy in the t-shirt, but you better talk to Tony.
I don’t want you heading out [00:41:00] there getting yourself into trouble, having to run over to the mall across the street at Santa Anita and buy a suit at the last minute. We don’t want to see that. We’ll see, we’ll see how it goes. We’ll figure something out, but looking forward to it. So everybody. Everybody tuned in on, uh, on Saturday sent those DVRs, let’s get these good ratings and we want you to give us more information.
You find out the correct name of the show and exactly where, and when you’re going to be on, we’ll share that on the Friday show. We’ll look back again to Pegasus day. We’ll talk about hidden scroll and all the rest, but that’s going to do it for this edition of the DRF. Player’s podcast. I want to thank Jonathan.
Kenshin playing hurt coming on with his larynx, sounding like it was stepped on by a fat man. I want to thank Michael McCarthy. What a dude to come on and do this running around, doing 17 different things. He sounded like he moved heaven and earth to do a few minutes with us today. And we appreciate that, but I’ll tell you what most of all, I appreciate all of you.
The listeners keep the subscriptions to the blog coming. Keep the subscriptions on [00:42:00] iTunes coming. Keep the visits to in the money podcast.com coming. The support has been amazing since we went out on our own, we want to keep it going. We want to make this show bigger and better than ever have a lot of ideas in that regard.
And thank you for your support all the way along. That’s it. We’ll be back on Friday. I’m Pete Thomas foreign, a towel. May you win all your photos?
there’s that great photo that’s been captured? I think Zoe Metz was the photographer guys. This is awkward, but I got to go let the dog out. Mike there’s the first time I’ve been interrupted in an interview to let the dog in,[00:43:00] I’m going to have to find a way to use this audio.