NYRA Bets Show for Saturday, May 25 (The Big A)

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Hello and welcome to the NYRA bats late pick five podcast. This is our show for Saturday, May 25th. I’m your host, Peter Thomas foreign, a towel back with you in the Brooklyn bunker once again, and I’m joined by the usual. Cohost of basically all the podcasts I do. I’m talking about a man. You might’ve saeen him on such productions as NBC triple crown coverage, a regular on Fox sports has coverage of horse racing.

We’re talking about the people’s champion, Jonathan kitchen. What’s up JK. PTF what’s going on. You got me up early this morning, but that’s how much I love you. You pick the time. I’d like to point out, I mean, come on, who’s doing who a favor here. Um, I like getting up early and something about getting up early makes you feel like you’re accomplishing something.

It doesn’t matter what you’re doing. I agree with that. I absolutely agree with that. And we are joined by our friends. First repeat guest on this NYRA bats late pick five show. You’ve seen him all over the place to hear the fine work he does on the horse racing radio network, as well as talking horses and the NYRA programming in general.

We’re talking about the beast of the Belmont, the big a Anthony sta bill. What’s up my friend. All right guys, what’s happening? Yes. The beast is back. I was a little bit of a delayed return. Um, usually comes back to the day after the Preakness bus. We had wrap that game of Thrones on Sunday night. So late Sunday, early Monday, I don’t even remember what time you got here.

I was still in a, in a puddle of my tears. So, um, We got to see what’s on the beast arrived, but he got back late Sunday, early Monday. I like it. Speaking of game of Thrones, this is a very important programming note, especially if you’re the type of person who cares about spoilers. We are going to talk game of Thrones, but we’re not going to do it.

In the main body of this show, the main body of the show is going to be the late pick five on Saturday at Belmont, we’re going to close the show, sort of like a false finish, like a good, uh, Ric flair, Ricky Steamboat match from back in the day, you’re going to hear the music play. If you’re somebody. For whom spoilers are a problem.

Get outta here. When, uh, when that song is on, it’ll probably be Jonathan Richmond again. And then the, when the song ends, we’re going to come back on and we’re going to do some game of Thrones chatter. So I just want to put that out there if it’s on autoplay and you don’t want spoilers, like get ready to hit that button and turn it off.

But I would imagine most of you are going to want to stick around to hear, because I am, I have the pleasure right now of talking to. Two of the biggest game of Thrones fans. I know, I think, and certainly the two biggest, I know within horse racing in Anthony’s to Beale and Jonathan kitchen. So that should be a lot of fun, but we’ll get to that in a minute.

Right now, we’re going to go directly to race six at Belmont park it on Saturday. It is an allowance race scheduled for six furlongs on the turf, looking at the forecast per, despite the rain, which you can hear some of in the background here in the Brooklyn bunker, I think. It is going to be clear for the next few days.

Apparently we don’t have any danger of this coming off the turf. I don’t think, I hope I don’t get struck by lightning for saying that. So we’re going to proceed with the idea that we’re staying on the turf and Anthony, we’re going to start with you and your view of this one. Yeah, Friday and Saturday supposed to be absolutely beautiful.

So the Thursday, right. Uh, even if we get some Thursday night guys, I think it’ll be, uh, uh, I, I can’t imagine it’s going to affect the course. Maybe there’ll be some given the ground. There’s been some given these courses since, uh, since jump street, since we opened Belmont the last weekend of April, uh, we’ve got a couple of affirm days, but even then, I don’t think we’ve ever gotten to those from, from courses.

We’ve had the last couple of Springs West. Track records fell on feed about a daily basis on an hourly basis. Track records didn’t last 18 hours. So, um, we, we haven’t gotten to that, uh, pool table, like velvet, uh, where they’re just running and rolling all over itself. Uh, they’ve, they’ve played fair for what I’ve seen, which is a good thing.

And this is an interesting way to start the sequence. So the interesting sequence is a couple of maiden races. Like Jonathan said before we went on air it’s turf, sprint central and, uh, Yeah, this is a, this is a good one. Chelsea Cloisters comes in and she comes in with the best resume. As far as class is concerned, she ran in the maintenance special, late events at Keeneland shock.

Our two year old filly to Wesley wardrobe at Keeneland in the spring. It’s been a steady diet of steaks since, uh, Ascot juvie. And then Sarah told her Caitlin Churchill and back to Kim Lynch ran well, ginger nut shipped in for Sadler and rolled in that turf sprint stakes down at Keeneland during the spring meet, she comes back now she’s got the race under a belt.

It was her first on five and a half months. . Or she has some tactical speed and there’s really not a lot of gas in the early on. I wouldn’t even be surprised if she was on the front end. So I’m going to use Chelsea Cloisters. I’ll use a little that’s she’s the four, the six stellar agent has served sprinted once.

That’s what she broke her maiden. First time out of the big price up at the spa. Another one, she ran it the newspaper of record twice. And then upon her return this year, she went into concrete roads down in the Florida Oaks at Tampa. They’re the two I want to lean on the most mentality. The set, the two is the other Wesley ward and the seven positives you for Chad, I’ll use those as backups, but Chelsea Cloisters and stellar agent on top of me, it makes perfect sense.

Chelsea Cloisters has that speed of the speed look and the form lines of stellar agent. That’s just, eye-popping the company that jeez had to compete against JK. Where are you in this race? Yeah. Typically, there’s a lot of things I hate in this race. Um, I hate Wesley ward stretching out. I don’t care if it’s the half for long.

I don’t like him adding distance. Um, I don’t like horses cutting back going six. So since I hate everything, I kind of love everything. Right. It’s full circle. So shows the closures. I agree with him. She’s going to be dead loose. Um, Mainly because the other competitors are horses that are, that are cutting back.

And so I don’t see how they’re going to, to pressure her. Sometimes these riders and these trainers will get a little bit cute with a horse that’s supposed to be loose on the lead, and then they’ll invite other horses into the race. It’s not a mistake that I predict that Johnny V and Wesley ward will make what Chelsea, Chelsea Cloisters.

I think she’ll be loose. The other horse that I’m going to use that Anthony didn’t mention is, uh, Moravia or Moravia down on the inside. That horse had a pretty tough trip. Last time, if you watch the replay replay, they’re not, like I said, not crazy about the cutback. Um, you know, th there was a trip, obviously going, going the mile, but now we’re going to go six, but obviously showed enough talent.

Um, and that race, uh, kind of overcoming, not overcoming the trip, but at least staying in contention with the awful trip that I think she can be used to. So I’m going to use Moravia, Chelsea Cloisters and stellar agent, but I’m going to make sure to hit the, uh, the combinations, including Chelsea Cloisters.

Three to four more times. All right. We’re going to move on to the seventh race before we do just a, a note that we’ve made a lot of times on the various shows that we do about maiden races in pick sequences. You do have the opportunity with the seventh race while you can’t see. The tote board for the wind market, you can look at the doubles markets and see horses who may unexpectedly be taking money, et cetera, not a bad tool to use before writing out your first leg of the pick five is to try to use that extra little bit of signal.

If you’re somebody like I know I am, who is very sensitive to wanting to include maidens who are bat, who you wouldn’t necessarily think they would be JK. We’re going to keep it with you for your thought on the seventh. So this next statement by no means, am I saying I’m great. I’m just saying, I think great.

Andy cappers, I think great handicappers, a good trait of a great handicapper is they know what they don’t know. And I have no clue. I have no clue in this race. It’s a, it’s a seven for a long-term sprint. You’ve got firsters. You’ve got horses that have run before. I mean, my list of horses that I would use are about eight, right?

Um, You mentioned something that I think is important, looking at the double, uh, probables, uh, one thing that I’ve a trick that I use, if it’s a sequence that I feel like I need to play, because I liked the first leg. I like the third or fourth leg. Um, I will look at the doubles and I will take the first five horses in a race where I have zero opinion that are taking money.

So whoever those first five are, I’ll take those five horses and then I’ll look for something else that might offer a little bit of value to maybe add on, to have a six. Or seven tours because this race is wide open that the Cassie horse on the rail can run. You know, it could, could possibly run a fight night for Weaver, who’s adding blinker or taking blinkers off.

Um, the horse that I probably like the most on form. Is riot for L and J Fox woods. The horse was, uh, it was about to one on debut at Belmont, uh, on the dirt. Now switches over to the turf. Obviously they were betting the horse for a reason there’s talent. There, there’s a reason that a horse gets bet in New York or California or Florida first time out.

Uh, the word usually gets out. So I would expect that horse riot, adding blinkers to, uh, to improve a little bit. But like I said, I’m going to try to try to get away with using six or seven in this spot. And I’ll get skinny later in the car. Anthony any way we can narrow this down a bit more than that. I couldn’t agree with Jonathan more.

He had this, you know, you need to, with everything he’s at, um, I think there’s two things you need to identify as a good handicap, right? Before anything else, your weak points, the chinks in your armor, and you have to that your best opinion very quickly. My best of I didn’t make any money I made. I shouldn’t say any.

I broke about even in the freakness. My two biggest, my biggest opinions in the Preakness where I hated improbable, and I hated always mining. You had a favorite and the co third choice, and I only thought two horses could win the race war of will and bourbon war. And I didn’t make anywhere near as much money as I should because I needed to spread more.

And I didn’t, I had tunnel vision. Um, In this, in this instance, it’s the exact opposite. Like Jonathan said, this is one of the toughest races and I’ve been doing, talking horses on a pretty regular basis. I missed just a few cards during the meet. This was probably the toughest race I’ve looked at so far at this meet because you have a lot of firsts that you have horses jumping on the turf for the first time.

It’s, you know, more often than not, you’ll catch a race like this. There’ll be two or three old reliables well, over liable one is usually Linda Rice. Second time. Well, guess what? Linda’s ballet got beat. Linda’s Linda Rice. Second time now she’s third time. And what really happens third time? Yeah, they win, but they’re not as prolific as second time out.

You’ve got fight night coming in from California. First time for George Weaver, the blinkers come off, the horse ran down the Hill. That’s all, you know, that’s a kitchen sink. That’s a lot going on for all like fight night and people see the California forum and the open company, and she’s going to take a lot of money.

Um, And then you have a bunch of firsts there’s you got fetching who I think you have to use from the rail, from our Kasey. Uh, the horse I’m going to put on top is looked lady, Georgia. . Has a nice work tab down upon Meadows and up at Saratoga. Um, you know, but there’s a horse in here. Sandra is mine. The number nine was 116 to one last time.

And she had this weird kind of trip where she lost some ground on the turn. And then she picked horses up late. Probably wasn’t as much as her picking horses up late as them coming back to her, but she has the rays off the two and a half months. She went to seven furlongs already, which a few of these haven’t done, which I think is important, especially at that distance.

And she gets a key rider change that your wall was REO. She’s going to be a price. I’ll use a Philly like car. If walk pneumonia comes in off the list, uh, you know, cutting back to a two term miles were straight seven eights with the outside draw ARIDE. She’s the worst you got use. This is an absolute crapshoot.

I’m putting Bluffton lady on top, just as a little bit of a shot in the dark. I’m going to stay kind of towards the inside. And here I’m using the one, two, three, and five mostly, but I’ll have some nines. I’ll have some tens, uh, maybe some 11th and 13th, like Jonathan said, All right, let’s move on to the eighth race maidens again, fortunately only two first-time starters.

So you’re betting into it blind, but not as, as much of a disadvantage as if the seventh and eighth races were swapped. Anthony, we’ll keep it with you for a thought on this one. I put the first, there was one, three in here. Um, and this is a little bit of a personal preference. I have had a lot of success, especially at Belmont park with Brian Lynch, first time starters.

Uh, and now I’m going to take a five-year-old first time starter. This is something I do not own early do, but I think it’s hard to look past her work tab. It’s hard to look past the fact that he’s getting cozy or tease to ride this horse. And I remember a while ago, there’ve been some rumblings that this filly could run and now she’s a mayor.

Um, and the fact that they persevered with her and this has nothing to do with it. I’m a huge fan of, uh, uh, her namesake. Uh, I feel like for them to have stuck around, kept this Philly around for so long. And I mean, if you look at her work there, she’s obviously fast. She is not catching the toughest bunch of runners.

Like I said, I put the first there’s one, three in here. I split them with toss up who, uh, still sad. Every time I see Rick Violet’s name and the previously trained byline, um, it was funny. We want to make a phone call the other day and I saw Rick’s number in the, in the phone. I just couldn’t bring myself to delete it.

Uh, She ran well, you know, debuted her and that stakes raised a little New York board race, closing day, et cetera. At Belmont, before we went up to the spa and the Lynbrook, she ran into the gallery, you can test the experience made in beauty, was on a roll for gallery at the time. And then she just got beat, uh, in, in that special ed race a month later, we’re at the spa.

We haven’t seen her now in nine months. So obviously something went. Yeah. The went the wrong way, but she comes back, Pat Kelly, you know, a few millennials out there. They just started coming around this game, Pat Kelly, Katrina resources, as good as anyone. So, um, Don’t let that deter you from using her. If she comes back to that two year old form and takes the necessary and the logical step forward from two to three, she’s going to win this race.

I don’t really trust the rest of the run. So I’m going to use toss up and I’m going to put the first is around them. And I notice you very cheekily Anthony avoiding actually pronouncing ratage Koski there. So I’ll, I’ll do it right. Thank you very well. You never know. You have to know your flaws. My friend, you have to know your floor, Jake, where are you in racing?

She was in the, uh, in the entourage movie. Wasn’t she? I believe that’s among her many credits. Yes. Kind of know from the blurred lines video, but that’s a story for another part. Uh, look, I’m ice cold here. This is, this is where, uh, cause I’m gonna, I’m gonna use four in the last two legs of each of each of the last two races.

I’m going to single toss up here. Uh, the old Duke Matisse taught me this angle with the two year old figures, you can find a figure that a two year old ran that matches what the three-year-olds are running now. And you get that natural progression that Anthony mentioned earlier from two to three, I’m going to single toss up here.

Um, the five-year-old mayor thing made a ton of sense to me. I was, I was interested there. The fact that Jose showed up the works, that, that, that the, uh, just give me the one. Give me the one. Who’s got the big number back in August. He has a two year old and, and, uh, see if we can’t get alive to something here.

All right. Race nine is the paradise Creek stakes going seven furlongs on the grass. Jonathan, you already tipped your hand that you’re spreading here. Give us the four you’re interested in and give us a top. Yeah. So strike silver fog of war, pull setter and mucho. And I’ll just give you quick thoughts about each of them.

Mucho, I think is interesting. Um, you know, when you look at the pedigree and you look, you know, one of the things I think we all do is you look at the dam and you see if they have any turf winters, and that’s kind of your indicator. I like to take it a step further with, with time from us. And you can look to see what those siblings have done.

So width and length are the two siblings of mucho that ran on the turf. They didn’t win on the turf. But they had a one Oh nine time form figures and a one 10 time phone figure. That means they can run on the turf. They just didn’t win on the turf. So there’s some turf there for me. I’ll use mucho.

Obviously we know what he did at Saratoga. Hasn’t done much since maybe this will wake him up. Pull center had the freaky performance last time. And, and, and, and that horse, uh, the siblings of that horse are three for 17 on the turf, so that that horse can run on the turf a little bit. And then the two inside horses are class angles, um, fog of war and strikes.

Silver, just look at the PPS. There’s really not much to talk about there. They, they make a lot of sense. I’m going to use those for, uh, if I was pressing somebody, I would press. Uh, pole setter, fog of war, certainly leaped off the page to me, one that was well-regarded and of course has that form to our most recent Preakness winner or of will from the, from the summer stakes.

Anthony, where you in the paradise Creek. I am. I have been waiting with bated breath for over eight months for the return of father. Why was a big, big fan of this horse last year? You know, if Chad Brown has a chink in his armor, it would be the turf sprints just don’t feel like he’s as successful as you would think.

A guy like him would be when this is what his brokers made in first time out in one of those five and a half races in Saratoga. The radar goes up because he did it the right way. He CA you know, he didn’t have really a lot of speed. He just came and got the horses on the front end. And he, he, when he ran by them, he did it with a purpose, and then he didn’t have the best, uh, the best start in the summer up at Woodbine.

And he kept coming. I mean, we know now with the horse that he’s beat is, is made of what’s the beach, probably the best three year old. Out there right now in Wharf. Well, on, uh, on dirt anyway, but he was stolen. He was a good turf horse and I won’t be too surprised if we saw him back on turf at some point in his career.

If he stays around next year, I just think he’s the goods. The only horse I’m going to use on a backup ticket is mucho because mucho is the fastest horse in this race. But we don’t know what he could do on surf. And obviously the two different surfaces and Jonathan alluded to his pedigree, you know, on paper, he has a fantastic turf pedigree.

The siblings ran fast. It just, they weren’t the winning types on turf. They really weren’t the winning hikes period. So I don’t think you can hold that against them, but yeah, he’s the only other one that makes any sense to me. I strike silver. He got a really good setup. In the Indian summer that he wanted Caitlin, they had a ton of speed.

The course, uh, of course, was playing a little, little slow. I shouldn’t say slow. It was playing a little wet that day. And he, he came and picked those horses up and got up. And then, you know, the next two races is the rudest cup race, and then never turned a blind bullet and they just weren’t very good. Um, but he makes sense.

Off of his feed fingers. And, uh, the other one I used was Ian glass. Who’s cutting back. And maybe if you can get some pace in front of him going to seven eighths, but again, this is all about fog of war, maybe a little mutual from me, but that’s all I was able to see in the paradise Creek. Anthony, I do believe based on your war of wellbeing, the best three-year-old comment, Gary West has crossed your name off his holiday card list.

Just a warning. That’s that’s. That is theirs. I have no problem with that. That’s a list. I’m I’m happy. I’d rather be on Arias list than that guy.

Oh, you’re killing me. All right. Let’s move on guys. Bananas at this point, man. 5 million let’s move on to the nightcap. We’ve got a turf allowance. Anthony, how are we going to get paid in this NYRA bets late pick five. Well, I don’t know. You know, I’m going to use a few in here. I know Jonathan mentioned about using four.

I had an idea about four or five in here as well. A lot of these horses have run against each other. And, you know, I think you learn when you look at the cheaper races, like, you know, on HR and I’m covering races from you name a racetrack, we’ve probably covered it. I tried to men, I tried to write them down.

One day, I stopped at like 21 racetracks that we’ve covered, which is pretty impressive for a show that’s only on three days a week. Um, I’ve come to learn that when they run against each other and they beat each other more often than not, when a fresh face comes in. He, or she usually beats him like a drum because these horses can literally just take turns against each other.

I think that’s the case. Yeah. I’ve been a final frontier fan for a long time. Uh, he of course was, uh, the subject of that. Controversial inquiry to double DQ you down did absolutely nothing wrong in Saratoga last year. Uh, he probably should have come down. He came back and you know, his race after that at Belmont, that was when we were getting all the rain here in New York on the bog.

He ran pretty good that day Clyde’s image has come back and certainly proved themselves to be a useful horse. And then he came back and he turf sprinted. And man, it certainly seemed like that’s what he wanted to do because he a Nyellie weighted that field in late November and aqueduct and dirties, a nice horse thirties, a nice turf sprint sprinters, a stakes winning turfs renter.

And now he’s running against a bunch of horses in here that. Take turns feeding each other. I think if he comes with his best day now, you know, Jose was scandals and mama for the days running a bunch of steaks down the shore on Saturday, Jose or teas takes over the source has tactical speed. There’s plenty of early speed in here, man.

I just think he looks like he’s going to get a great setup. I’m using him right. Fake jellies. Another one, he really hasn’t danced a lot of dances with the usual suspects in here. He should benefit from the pace Jason service router T’s Jr. Savings and ground. I’ll use him spectral lights, just a really cool horse.

You know, he came off that year and a half and he won last time. Maybe he’s the speed of the speed. And I guess you got to respect battle station. So I’m going to close one of my tickets. One, five, seven, 11, I’ll close another ticket one seven, and then I’ll have a couple of tickets, singled to final frontier.

Oh, it makes perfect sense. A good blended approach, JK, same question. As I asked you for race nine, who are your four and give us a top selection. Some, a lot of my, for this team is Anthony he’s. I fig jelly, uh, final frontier. Um, I think I’m going to use commute. I’m not sure if I heard him mentioned that one in spectral light as well.

Um, you know, turf sprints are interesting. I think a lot of people, uh, have issues with them. I think a lot of people, a lot of handicappers find them to be hard puzzles. And I think the reason that that happens is because cause closures don’t usually win term sprints. Even if they look like they’re gonna fall apart, it just doesn’t happen.

So I think that might frustrate HorsePlayers or use common sense when they see seven horses and need the lead and they think they’re going to find a close to the close run to get there, somebody wires and, and, and I think that happens. More often than not. The other thing I’ll say about turf sprints is that I think that turf sprints are the most forceful races that we have.

The problem is, is that I think they’re also the hardest races to make figures about. So it’s like, if you can find a good failure it’s right. And it’s going to lead you to the winners circle, but if there’s a big chance of the figures wrong. So, um, I think if you approach these races as formed races, you’ll find them to be a little bit easier.

Um, I think commute makes the most sense to me. If I had to make my top selection, uh, first time Navarro, they, you know, they went, they went five down at Gulf stream on the dirt. He had a little bit of trouble there. He was, he was kind of ranked throughout. Then they stretched him out and he seemed to kind of relax a little bit more.

Uh, out on the front end and he was clear and now he’s coming back here going six. Uh, I know Jorge kind of struggles from time to time in New York, but he can also get a winter here. I think commute makes a little bit of sense, uh, for me there. And then, and then the horses that, uh, that Anthony mentioned all make sense as well.

Fig jelly had the big figure. Last time, Jason service has been a little bit cold since the Derby, but, uh, uh, I don’t doubt that. He’ll find a way to turn that back on. So those are the four for me now, like I said, the big stand for me in the sequences is with toss up in the eighth. And if I can get him home, I feel like I got a good enough coverage everywhere else to try to cash a ticket, lots of good ideas from the team.

And we’re going to do our little false finished. Now I’m not going to do the credits or anything, but we’re going to hit the music. If you don’t want game of Thrones spoilers, this is your chance to get out of here. People. I love spending time in New York,

spring time in New York, spring time in New York.

All right, guys. Now this is, I was really excited to hear your thoughts on the  pick five, but I’m really excited to hear your thoughts on this. I guess I’m going to call it controversial based on what I’ve seen on the interwebs, the reactions of a lot of fans to game of Thrones, Anthony, you, as one of the biggest game of Thrones fans, I know.

What was your general thought on the finale? I, um, I, I, you guys know, uh, we’ve gone. We both got to know each other pretty well the last year or so. Um, I am an open book. I am a very emotional, um, so I was preparing myself for the worst. I thought it was going to be a complete. Blood bath. I thought they were going to be three, maybe four characters left when all was said and done.

Uh, so when you see the one person who needed to die after the bells, The nearest I guarantee and had to go, um, when she’s pretty much it, I, I felt like it was a really good finale and I felt okay with everything, you know, you get attached to these characters and I put up a big Facebook post, um, about, you know, how this fiction really, really spoke to me.

Um, you know, I would watch, uh, an incestuous. Twin brother and sister fall in love and, you know, do anything they could for that love. And at the time I wasn’t with my girlfriend, the person, I think, you know, I know I along with the rest of my life and we found that way back to each other. Um, you know, so it, it spoke to me in a way that I think a lot of people think is too fanatical, but I don’t, as you guys both know, I really don’t.

I don’t care what other people think. Um, so for everybody to be okay, For the main characters to be okay. When it was all over with, I thought it was great and I really liked the way. Everybody’s doing what they kind of wanted to do, except bran, who is doing what in the position he’s taken, kind of has to do, right.

If you know everything, you got to run everything that’s though. And you know, a lot of people in this world in the real world, They know everything and don’t get the chance to run everything. Well, guess what? He knows everything and he’s going to get to run everything that’s utopia if you asked me. So, uh, yeah, I, I thought it was really well done.

I would like to hear the end of the, uh, Jackie has some honeycomb story with Terry and the Bravo one of these days. Maybe we’ll get it. I don’t know. I just read that the second time when you started that, the first time, uh, the, the wise masters of Astra four stopped us this time, Dave and Dan stopped us from hearing the end of it.

Um, but yeah, I had, I really liked it. You were thoroughly satisfied? I, I was ultimately satisfied. I had some quibbles. I’ll get to my quibbles in a minute, but JK, I want to just get your general reaction satisfied or uncensored is your name on the petition to reshoot season eight, JK. No, no, no, no, my name’s not on that petition or the Kentucky Derby party.

There was no petition for me. Um, I believe in that amendment, what does that the first amendment? I believe it’s the first yet. I believe in it, but no, I’m not on it. Um, here’s what I’ll say. I got a couple of thoughts. First one is when it comes to brand being the, the, you know, ultimately winning the throne or not necessarily wanting to throw on the, being the leader.

I think that the one thing that you can take from that is, and the, the message there is, is that know there’s an old quote that, uh, and I’m actually reading it. I didn’t have this memorize. I’m not that sharp. Those who do not remember the past are contempt or condemned to repeat it. Right. He, he remembers the past.

He knows everything from the past. So what better leader? He, he’s a, he’s a kind person. He comes from a great family. He doesn’t have any weird, crazy backstories or histories of hurting or harming people. I mean, how, how, how much better can, can the realm be being led by someone who has as every memory that he can access every memory of every one from whatever.

I think that’s great. Um, I also loved the fact that like his counsel at the end was like all the decent people on the show. Right? Even the worst person sitting on his council, which was Braun is still a decent person. Right. He just liked, uh, he liked some things in life that maybe people might think are controversial.

He would have been a great horse player. So that’s the first thing I’ll say is that I’m very satisfied with how it ended, because honestly, Who would be better? Not Jon snow, not, I mean, no one would be better than brand to lead the realm. Now, with that said, that’s not the ending I wanted. Um, it’s not the ending that I had predicted would happen, but then that comes to the other point of the people that are disappointed.

I’m also mature enough to know that it’s not my show. I don’t own that show. I didn’t create that show. It’s not my art. That show I was fortunate enough to go on exactly right journey with the show. I was fortunate to go on a journey with the show. I was fortunate enough to, to, to, to be taken on a roller coaster of emotions.

There’s a roller coaster of emotions for seven years. I fell in love with Danny and how awesome she was. And I even forgot some of the horrendous things she did throughout that time. Cause it was like, it was hidden by her character of how they were gray. Yeah. They were gray or the, you saw the brutality in her, but it was always, you could always, you could, you could make the case that it was on the side of right until, until you could cut, you could, until you couldn’t, it’s not very organic.

After when the bells, I was like, come on, come on, Danny. No, come on, come on, come on, come on. You know, like I had that emotion now. Here’s where people are upset and I have a very good understanding of this. I think they’re upset because it’s not what they wanted and they’re not mature enough to realize that like that it’s not their choice.

And, and they’re, they’re, they’re mad because it took them to a place. They didn’t want to go. And, and they were happy about that previously, but now they’re not. And the other thing is it’s impossible to end these damn things. Right. I mean, people hated the Sopranos ending. I think it’s brilliant. Um, and, and the last thing I’ll say is, is that, is that, you know, the, the one thing I, I will say that I I’m, I’m still, still processing is, was the final season rushed.

Yeah. So come on, go. Are you kidding me? But, but here’s here. I know that’s your, that’s probably going to be your thing. Let me, so I’ll say my little piece. I’ll let you go if they want to have, if they would. Okay. Now look, they could have drug it out and then people would be complaining that it was that’s fair.

That’s totally fair. Did drag out a lot for, for seven years or for seven seasons, you know, eight years. It was, it was, it was drug out, but they were building to these moments. I don’t think they need it. You know, people were complaining that, that, that Danny’s character arc. She just turned into a psychopath.

Yeah. That’s wrong. That was planted. That was brilliant. Done. Yeah, that was brilliant. It was progressive when John turned her down and Ms. Sunday got her head cut off. That’s what put her over the edge. Don’t forget. Jorah don’t forget. Jorah that played into it too. As a wrestling fan. It was an absolutely perfect heel turn.

Like you couldn’t, you couldn’t have booked it better from a wrestling point of view to take that, to take this character and, and plant all that seeds of why she’d have that resentment, you know, uh, Andre turning on Hogan as nothing on, uh, Danny turning on, turning on the world. I thought that was, uh, I thought that was great.

I mean, I just, look, I’m not lumping in with Andre and Hogan man legend, but that’s where it belongs. The dragon belongs with. I challenge you to a world wrestling Federation match up the WrestleMania. That’s where I was there that night, by the way, Brandenburg arena. Yeah, I, yeah, I it’s up there with that.

She, they, they, she flipped it. Then she flipped out. That was, and the heel turn, the wrestling analogy. Pete is perfect. Yeah. I want to ask you, I mean, to me, the rushed stuff is like, I think it really fell down for me. I was having, Oh my goodness. Goosebumps and everything at the big moment with John and Danny to go straight from that, to.

The scene that we saw of the, the de facto coronation. I guess the thing that I could never believe, I just couldn’t believe that gray warm would leave John alive. Like that just made no, no sense to me that felt very contrived. If I have a problem with the finale, it’s the idea that the Unsullied would just be like, okay, our leader’s gone.

Uh, and we’re okay with that. And we’re just going to follow the rules of these people that we’re not associated with, that I didn’t buy, but I mean, all I’ll give it what they call the willing suspension of disbelief. It doesn’t ruin the finale for me, but if I’m looking very objectively, it did fall down in that regard.

Anthony, what’s your thought on that? I, I think, I think everything was a little rushed, but I’m not one of these people that needed another whole season. I thought of two more episodes would have really done this. Well. Um, I would have taken two more seasons, obviously gladly. I would take 22 more seasons.

Um, but maybe another episode leading up to the night King, um, No, no, no people want backstory. There’s no backstory needed about death, right? Whether it’s in the fictional world or it’s in our world, the real world death is death. There’s not much to describe death when it comes to you. It’s over. If you believe in God and an afterlife, you hope that there’s something waiting me.

I hope I get to go to Western house when I go. Um, but you know, it’s, they. They get, and they gave you a backstory in the tribal council when they were having the tribal council almost survive. And they were having the kid, the war council meeting. Right. What does he want? He wants it endless night. All right.

Well, you know what, there’s all the backstory I need. Uh, I have a few friends that were upset. They never confirmed, he was a talk Gary, and to me, he had to be a talk area. Number one, when they turned them, when they showed, when they showed the night King B created by the children, he had blonde hair and blue eyes in the show.

That is the stamp of a target area. Uh, that’s number one, number two. He could ride a dragon. Now you could say that he was able to write a dragon cause of death, but we could also say that he was a target area. Three. He could not be killed by fire. The rest of the whites could be killed by fire. The white walkers could be killed by fire.

He couldn’t, he’s a target area. That’s it. I don’t need them to tell me that I’m smart enough and I’ve paid enough attention to know he’s a target area. So there was things where I don’t think they needed to get into it. You want to drag it out for a couple more episodes? Sure. Um, I would have liked to have seen two things I’d like to have seen Aria shift.

Sorry

to me. It would have been a little bit more believable. Had there been a confrontation on screen between John’s forces and the unsolved lead. And I think they should have settled that with good old fashioned trial by combat. I think that would have been a sensation. That’s an episode I would have watched.

Wow. Yeah. I feel like those two things. Going back to episode five, maybe a little bit better version of the game bowl. I want to see them two guys get out when there’s not 400 other things going on. But other than that, I mean, there was, these are minor complaints. I’m good. I really am so, so I, I got a couple of, of, of, of things.

Um, um, one being, I’ve always found it like a little bit awkward when people refer to the white walkers as the white. Fair enough. Fair enough. I’ve always thought though. It’s what makes your teeth into a little bit? The other thing, because if they were the black walkers and people were referring to him as the blacks, that’d be very uncomfortable.

The other, the other thing is what I’ve kind of experienced. And it’s gotten me frustrated at some friends, too. I have those friends. You have Anthony, Pete, you have them too, that are like, I’m not watching that fantasy show. And I, and I try to explain to them. And I just want to get some more coaching. And I also want to give some people, some other ideas of what I say, look, the dragons, the white walkers, the, the, the magic, it’s his, it’s a side note to a story about power and loyalty and commitment and love and loss.

And it’s like all of these powerful themes that, that existed inside of the Sopranos. Minus the dragons. So I try to explain that to people. How do you guys handle that? Do you experience it well, where are you at with that? Okay, Anthony, I’ll let you go first. I have a quick thought on it. Yeah. Uh, see, I think it takes a lot of people by surprise that I.

Love this show as much as I do, because I’m the guy making fun of the people watching Twilight and Harry Potter and Lord of the rings. That’s why even Lord of the rings. Wow. That’s surprise. I get the first two Lord of the rings. I would have thought if you like game of Thrones, you’re like Lord of the rings that surprised.

Oh, I’m a big bully when it comes to all that fantasy Dungeons and dragons crap. One till October 5th, 2014, uh, closed hatches gets our head caved in, in the spinster Keeneland. And I get talked into watching the first episode. I like, I know the date. I started watching the show because my Philly got a head caved in.

Um, And then it was just like, what is this? I mean, this is unbelievable. I love the people that are like, how could you watch that show? Nothing happens in the first five in the first season. Yeah. Nothing happens in the first season. You found that a brother and sister was sleeping with each other and the guy throws an eight year old kid off a 90 foot.

Castle. That’s not enough for you in the first episode of the show. That’s not enough for you, maybe the show isn’t for you. Um, yeah, like you said, Jonathan, this at the end of the day, it’s a love story, right? That’s really what it is. She, she goes mad, right? The, the, the, the, the climax of the show is she goes mad.

Danny goes mad because ultimately, John. Did not accept and return her love. I honestly think that she felt like she lost the love. I don’t think anybody was gonna love her more than Jorah. She lost that. And then she wanted John and John didn’t want her. I think that’s what ultimately gets a love story. I think you guys are making, you’re making a lot of great points.

There are certain people though, J K for whom that they’re just what I would call fantasy intolerant. And I would preface this show. I would previs Lord of the rings, which I love as saying, look, if you’re somebody who just can’t do fantasy, you’re not going to like it. But if you’re ever going to enjoy something in a fantasy realm, Give it a shot.

My regret. This is probably silly because I think Searcy’s arc ended pretty well. But since we were talking wrestling before I did have the thought of, I wouldn’t have minded, a little bit of a WrestleMania, 10 thing, only wrestling match. I can think of I’m sure there’ve been others. I think it was WrestleMania 10, but I’m talking about the famous match with Brett Hart and Shawn Michaels.

Where Michael’s goes in as the heel and goes out as the baby face. And heart goes in as the head and heart is the exact reverse. And I w I kind of wanted that moment. I kinda wanted that moment from Searcy, where there was some kind of like, Redemption, some sort of positive thing that she did to like help somebody other than herself at some point, alas not meant to be for me.

The show was really what I really liked about the show more than anything was I just thought it was just so many great performances from those actors and actresses. And of course were left wanting more. And there were some obvious setups for sequels Anthony, as you were alluding to before. I personally want to see drug on an Aria team up and like fight crimes or something, but I don’t know.

What, what, what, what sequel do you think, what sequel do you think we’ll be coming, uh, from the game of Thrones team? Or do you think they’re going to go? The prequel route has been as has been rumored. Where, what do you, what do you think about that? I think they’re going to go to free-fall route. I’ll be honest, mom, who does not watch the show is believed that they’re going to pull an American idol here and it’s going to be back in three years.

I got, I’ve never wanted mom to be more right in my entire life. The problem is these guys and gals are all having very successful careers after the show. I mean, you put your TV on and set it to any station that sells a lot of ads to movie companies, to production companies. And you can’t go. Three minutes without seeing an advertisement for a movie that a game of Thrones actor or actress is in.

Right. It’s amazing. And I think it’s a Testament because you know, you see a lot of these shows and you know, what has everybody done? I mean, take cheers. For example, cat dancing, what you housing for the most part, the rest of them haven’t done much. I mean, signed the, even the Seinfeld crew, they really haven’t done.

You know, anything, the friends cast look awful. Outside of that apartment and central perk. So, you know, now you see all of these guys and gals, I mean, Jason Mamoa is Aquaman, uh, sounds is in the X-Men movies. Uh, you know, Rob Stark’s in a movie. I don’t know their names off the top of my head, but, you know, kit, Harrington’s doing a bunch of stuff.

Uh they’re all Lena heavy was just in the, the movie about page, uh, the WWE diva. I’m Amelia Clark, Emilia Clarke in a star Wars picture. Yeah. Amelia clocks in the star Wars picture. And she was in a Terminator movie while they would shoot in game of Thrones. So, I mean, they’re all there. They’re all over the place.

So I would love to me personally, Ari is my favorite fictional character of all time. She is a supplant. It’s definitely done the Hara from is my favorite fictional character of all time. Other things I wouldn’t have guessed. So, um, I would love to see, you know, Aria who all of a sudden has become Christopher Columbus.

Uh, that would be great for me, but that’s because she’s my favorite character, but I’ll take anything. Um, um, um, you know, um, um, I’m open, I’m open to any and all. Okay. I know you have to go give us your quick thought of the sequel or prequel you want to see, and then we’re going to let you drop it. I have one more thought to run by Anthony before we wrap the whole show.

I’m good. I can stay. I can stay for a second. I think that the, it will be a pretty cool about MedStar. Um, I think that will be the, that’ll be the kind of starting point, um, with like Ned growing up and, and him and Robert paratha and like kind of, you know, Two and their whole thing starting off and leading.

I think that’s what the prequel will be. Um, but I haven’t, I do have a question for you three. Well, I mean, uh, or us three, um, who was your favorite? Like non main character for me, it’s not even close. It was, it was, uh, it was my man with the red hair, the wilding guy. Can’t remember his name. I’m going blank on it.

Oh my God. He’s totally walnuts. Right. That’s about right. Uh, I’m pulling warrants. Um, you guys was a big, I was a big, uh, A big fan of, of Patrick. And I was a big fan of Brian. I mean, Brian was, you know, talking about guys that are just true to that character. He was a cell sword, he was a cutthroat and he took each and every, but he was also a friend.

Right. I think after everything he was tearing his friend and then he was a cutthroat. But he wasn’t going to let either compromise the other. So when he goes there in episode four and he’s like, listen, you too. Believe me, the bleeps, somebody getting killed. Or I’m getting my cast. I would like footballs to be, I would like to everybody to live and I get my castle, but I’m just letting you know, I’m getting mine before you get yours.

He got his, and now he’s being rewarded. I mean, he, he was one of my favorites. He had great lines. Um, good Jerome Flynn, a great delivery. Great actor. Yeah. Uh, yeah. Did you know that him and Lena like dated and now they cannot be in the same room together it’s in their contract or not in the same surely made one mistake.

There’s a, there’s an, uh, there is one scene that I guess a body double stood in. It’s happens in the red keep she has the mountain with her, but he’s in there trying to get in. But then again, when, when they have the dragon pit scene, him and Padre go have a drink because they cannot be on the onset together.

Sorry, I didn’t know that I missed that. Gossip. Bron would be my character definitely seems like the person in the show. Most likely to be a successful pro punter. I would nominate Tyrian as the one who probably thinks he’s smart enough to be a pro punter who ends up losing it all somewhere. But that’s my thought on now, but you said minor character too.

So we can’t put Tyrian in that mix. One of the things I just wanted to note that I just something that I really enjoyed in the show that I heard some people complaining about was the DRO gun. Uh, John moment after Danny’s demise, which I thought was brilliant. There’s no point in drug on trying to do kill John for, for one thing.

He’s a tar Gary and he won’t burn. So, and he knows he’s a tar Gary. And that, that, that idea that I saw out there made no sense. And I also just thought it was one of the more poetic moments in the show of Drogon rather than, you know, attempting to kill, uh, the, the one who killed his, uh, his mother.

Destroying the symbol of power. Instead. I thought that was poetic and cool. Anthony, did you like that moment? I love that because to me it showed that, you know, and again, I know there’s magic involved, but I think throughout the series they showed the animals. All having a knowing sense, like good that the animals processed almost like the humans processed, right.

Uh, that the dragons knew they shouldn’t be, you’ve been locked up when they were in Marine, uh, that the dire wolves, you know, when, when lady ran wild lady got killed, but when, when the nine Miria ran off, after the incident with Joffrey, knowing she was like, they showed. That the animals knew right. When they were making out in the first episode and the dragons were looking on, like they, they show that the dragons had a capacity to learn and to know, and the fact that he burns what really killed his mother.

I think it was important. I think it was one of the, I think it was one of the best scenes in the series showing that the symbolism of, I know you may have put a knife through her, but you did it because of that thing. And we all got to this point because of that thing, I’m going to kill that thing. I thought it was perfect.

That was great. I want to re nominate my favorite minor character and go with ghost by the way. I loved ghost big ghost guy over here. All right. We’ve I think we’ve unpacked a good amount. Obviously we could do a whole other podcast series on this. Thanks to everybody who stuck around. And we appreciate that very much.

I want to thank Anthony Seville. I want to thank Jonathan kitchen. Most of all, I want to thank all of you for listening. And of course our partners over at NYRA bets for bringing this show to you, this podcast has been a production of in the money media in the money media’s business manager is drew Kotani.

I’m Peter Thomas foreign Italian Anthony. I’m going to let you bring us home. Well guys, I had a great time as always, hopefully we can make some money in this narrow bachelor pick five on Saturday. I just want to remind all listeners what his dad may never die.

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